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Discussion Starter #1
I've read emphatic opinions on both sides: you're crazy to clutch into 2nd on one wheel / you're crazy not to use the clutch into 2nd...

what do you guys think (and why)
 

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On one wheel? no clutch. I dont even see why you would do it any other way....


Having said that, why shift? Balance it in first and call it good....

EDIT: I mean shift with no clutch. Not bring it up with no clutch.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Vash said:
Having said that, why shift? Balance it in first and call it good....
true. it's all about the BP. i'm just so afraid of mousetrapping it. and it revs up so fast in first. i figure if i go to 2nd i'll have more time to try n find the BP and the benefit of less-sensitive throttle input. and plus rolling 'em down the highway = serious cool points.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
...which brings me to another question: what's the slowest speed @ which i could pull it up in 2nd and what kind of rpm's are we talkings? i'm on a 954.
 

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If I'm not mistaken, a 954 should do highway speeds at first. And good throttle control is the key to all of this. There are several advantages to doing it in first gear.
Should you loop it, you will be going slower, and it wont hurt as bad.
Should you get in trouble, you will have more engine braking in first, so a closed throttle will be more likely to bring you back if you forget all about the rear brake.

As for what the minimum speed, I'm willing to bet people can bring it up to 12 oclock from a stand still in second. If you are clutching it, speed really doesnt matter. I'm not too sure about the rpm either, I never bother to look at mine (and we dont even have the same bike) just try to hit at the bottom of the power band. You know when the power first starts getting there, for me its about 5-7k rpm. But once again, I dont really pay attention to that, just rev it a few times, and the rest is clutch work.
 

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Let me guess...

You've been dying to rip up some highway wheelies so you can bomb around and get that feeling of "goddamnit I/this kicks ass!". So you've asked some people, and visited some sites. I'm going to say that about 75% of the people have said "clutch? wtf would you do that for? Just let of the gas and jump up and down on the bike like a moron then twist it really hard with no control and horrible body position while yanking on the bars for no damn reason cause it won't do shit for you but twist them and make the bike come up at a weird angle". Well, thats actually probably not what they said. But thats what powering up wheelies translates to. To answer the question before you ask it, NO it does NOT hurt your tranny to clutch up a wheelie. When done CORRECTLY the only possible damage that you can do is take a few miles off your clutch. Most people who do wheelies on the highay won't have thier bike long enough to wear out a clutch anyway so it doesn't matter. as far as shifting in a wheelie... thats retarded. There is never any time that you should need to go faster than 2nd gear. On a 954 thats almost 100 mph. Just bring it up in second. Why use first. Especially if you're doin it on the highway. Mousetrapping is not from hitting balance point. You could be goin 2 mph still under bp and mousetrap it. I've done it multiple times (goddamn kill switch) the biggest problem you'll run into is brake control. If you want to do highway wheelies (which I can't openly condone but won't lie and say I don't do), you MUST learn how to ride wheelies first. There's nothing wrong with using first gear. Yes, it's a little more twitchy. that simply means you have to be smoother. Learn in an empty lot where you're not gonna hurt anyone, gear up, keep it in first gear, use your brake and master wheelies there. Once you've done that, and you know you're 100% comfortable with being on 1 wheel. The decision to do them on the highway is yours. Just remember... It's not legal. If you get caught, you have nobody to blame but yourself. If you wreck and hurt someone, its all on you. Best of luck and be safe. Let me know if you have any other questions. The clutch is your friend. Master it and theres nothing you won't be able to do. This isn't comming from some retarded yahoo on line. Pro stunter homey, pro stunter.

~the super :squid:
 

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contrary to what roadstain says, you can bring it up with no clutch, or with a clutch, it all depends on what your comfortable with.

Here is why i do not clutch it up, on more than 1 occasion, i have spun the rear tire while clutching it up, powering it up is more predictable, and smoother.

The downside, you gain more speed when powering it up, but once your good enough, you can sketch off speed, and bring it to what ever speed you want it at.

I ride my long standups, in third, at about 60mph, i bring them up in 2nd, at about 40-60mph, and i have never, i repeat never in about 4yrs of riding wheelies, crashed from doing a wheelie.

Oh and i use the clutch when i shift in a wheelie.
 

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Like I said, I use a little of both methods. If Im going pretty fast in second I have no problem leaning back giving it a little bounce and pulling it up. However, I don't see a need to shift while on a wheelie. If I pull it up in second I can ride it pretty much as long as I want. If you have to shift while on a wheelie that just means you are not near the balance point and you have to speed up to chase the wheelie. I do enjoy using the clutching method though. Roadstain is correct. When you learn how to clutch up the front wheel correctly it is the best way to do it. Clutching is more controlled and when you get good you can clutch right to balancing point. This is just my :2cents:
 

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i agree with most of what steve said, except the fact that clutch is better than no clutch, that comes down to the rider, also the only reason i shift in a wheelie, is for the added control of a higher gear, far less twitchy in 3rd, wich translates into smoother control.

I know several guys who shift all the way to 5th almost imediatly after bringing it up. and they never break 60mph in a wheelie.
 

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"The decision to do them on the highway is yours. Just remember... It's not legal"

Is the only place to be a careless/reckless driver on private property. My driveway is maybe 20 feet long, and I don't own a stretch of pavement. Everyone mentions to learn in a parking lot, which is wise because there are no cars, but wouldn't a person just as likely get a reckless driving ticket here as well as on a public street.

There is a huge community college parking lot by me, so what happens if a cop sees me practicing wheelies there? I wouldn't be on a public roadway, but I also don't own the property.

Is there a legal place to stunt in a city???
 

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That gets complicated.. If its a community college, then its still public property.. However if you do it in a private lot, then the only thing they can get you for is traspassing. If you have the owners permition, then there isnt a thing anyone can do about it.. well, they could still call it desturbing the peace I suppose.. That one is a catch all...
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Yea, I can bring it up consistently and comfortably in 1st... and I'm very close to BP, the nose is almost eye-level. And, yes, I've been clutching it up. You'd be proud, RoadStain.:thumbs2: I only ask about shifting into 2nd because I want a little more time to try n find the BP and I haven't been able to bring it up in 2nd~ not that it can't be done, I just am not revving it enough. Speaking of finding the balance point, is there a kill switch I need to disarm? Also, what kind of range are we talkin' about here (for the BP, that is): 5°? 20°? In other words, how big of a window am I aiming for? If I were to try n bring it up in 2nd, where do the revs need to be?
 

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most if not all EFI bikes have a tip over sensor that does need to be disconnected. If I remember correctly on the hondas you just need to disconnect it. Gixxers are much more difficult.

BP will be a small window depending on model and body position. On my bike it feels like a 4-6in window?

I would suggest going about 40 slip the clutch crack the throttle up to about 9-10K and quickly let it out. Start around 8 to be safe. Your natural reaction will be to let off the throttle when the front end comes up but just keep it constant till it comes to bp and use the rear break. If you learn break control you will be riding better wheelies in much less time.
 

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Most tip over sensors sence a side to side motion, not an up an down one...
 

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The tip over sensors are a metal ring, inside is a free floating metal rod or ball. And yes, you should definately desable this. Most bikes will not start if you just remve or unplug them. So what you do is...

Find the "switch" which isn't actually a switch. It's a black box. Kinda small. Open it up and inside you'll see the metal. ring. Hold it flat so that the piece inside is centered. Then fill it with epoxy. Let it dry. Now, the bike won't shut off if you get a nice high wheelie goin. Its helpful for anything involving stunting. You can also disable the switch on the kickstand if you do really high stoppies. When comming down sometimes the kickstand will extend just enough to activate the switch and shut the bike off. It's a pain in the ass. So, find the switch. And disable it however you please.

As far as the lots go. (I was told this by a state trooper) In order for it to be considered "on the public highway/road" You must be between the white lines on the highway. The community college parking lot is public property... but not a public highway. You will still be harrassed for doing wheelies there. I promise. Colleges will never allow it due to the liability and the fact that if you're seen then everyone will think it's ok to come to the school and dick around. Thus ruining it for everyone and putting the school in trouble. So.. Your best thing to do is, Find a mom and pop shop with a big parking lot and get permission. Construction companies usually have very large parking lots or loading docks that work great. They usually aren't there after 7 or 8 at night. And the area is still lit up. Talking them into letting you stunt shouldn't be to hard. Or, you can just do it if you're feelin brave. Industrial areas are great, plants and places that load truck always have big areas to stunt and should be rather prevalant in the city. Also, the loading areas are usually in the back. So you won't be seen. the less attention you draw to yourself the better. Usually the worst that they'll do is kick you out. Do what you can to get a legit spot with permission. I know it can be hard but its better than doin it on the highway. especially if you're learning. I just rolled up with the bike in the back of the truck, found the most important looking guy I could and said "mind if we play around in your parking lot?" He goes "uh.. just becareful guys. Have fun. Please don't come here if there are cars though". That was his only request. Got me a nice big parking lot at a verizon wireless building in the middle of nowhere. You just gotta look. There are places. Good luck
 

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I say do both whatever makes you comfortable but on a 954 there should be no reason you cant keep it in first and still do at least 85
 
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