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Discussion Starter #1
Do you guys think that it is easier to learn the shifting and friction zone of a bike, if you already know how to drive a manual trans car?

I took my MSF 4 day course last year...when I took the course, I didn't know how to drive a manual transmission car yet, only automatic. The first day on the bikes, I stalled the bike a whole bunch of times, it was because I started letting the clutch out slowly and rolling on the throttle, and right as I felt the bike start moving, I would just let the clutch out completely and it would stall.

This is the same problem I had (and I think it's the most common problem) when I was learning how to drive a stick shift car. I would have it in 1st gear, let the clutch out slowly and push on the gas pedal slowly, and right as I felt the car moving I would take my foot off the clutch completely and it would stall.

Well, that was last year, I know how to drive a manual trans car just fine now, I've had stick shift car for about 8 months or so, so I've been driving it for 8 months.

Do you guys think if I took the MSF riding portion of the course again I would do a lot better as far as shifting the bike goes, since I know how to drive a manual trans car?

I know they are 2 different things...(bike, and car) but as far as the concept of shifting goes, they aren't much different. This is just like hockey. I played roller hockey for 8 years. So I had 8 years experience on rollerblades. I started playing ice hockey about 2 years ago...the very first time I put ice skates on and was skating around the rink, I did really well and I think it's because I already had a lot of experience doing rollerblading which is the same concept as ice skating as far as how you take off from a stop and how you push your legs out and move your arms and all that.

This thread is wayy too long, I just realized that. Sorry guys.
 

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car is harder then a bike i find...but both are easy like cutting butter....mauals are more fun in a car because you can throw her in reverse build up some speed and then cut the wheel throw her in 1st and light em up like james bond would
 

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Re: totally different

docta_freeze said:
You use the clutch on a bike with ur hand not ur foot.. Same for the gas.
This is true. But if you understand what to do with a cars clutch you will understand what to do with a bike clutch. I rode a bike long before i ever got into a car. And I learned how to drive a car on a manual Tranny. Did not take me long at all.
 

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yep i had already owned a manual car before my bike so learning was so much faster than those i've seen learning to ride w/o ever driving a manual car. i would definitely say that knowing how to drive stick helps in the learning to ride process. even though hand and foot processes are switched on a bike, the principle and technique remain the same.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
93FZR1000 said:
yep i had already owned a manual car before my bike so learning was so much faster than those i've seen learning to ride w/o ever driving a manual car. i would definitely say that knowing how to drive stick helps in the learning to ride process. even though hand and foot processes are switched on a bike, the principle and technique remain the same.
My point exactly. I feel the same way, that's why I'm curious as to how much better I would do if I took the course again now that I know how to drive a stick.
 

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Big Dan 35 said:
My point exactly. I feel the same way, that's why I'm curious as to how much better I would do if I took the course again now that I know how to drive a stick.
The course will make you better period, regardless of your knowledge prior to taking it. :thumb: :)
 

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I actually find it much easier to learn how to manually shift on a bike, rather than a car. For one thing, you have enough limbs to cover all the controls without having to remove a foot or hand and operate something else. Also, I find the cluth usage on a bike to be far more user friendly, because motor-control of your hands is a bit easier than with feet, so you have more control. Well, that's my opinion anyway.

--Scott
 

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Naturally for it is not so much the shifting, but the handeling of the CLUTCH on both a cage & a m/c ALONG with how the throttle is used in unison.

A m/c is EASIER when it comes to shifting for one is not pushing/pulling the knob in specific ways. Look at the top rally car people & their shifting is similiar to a m/c & so NOT the selecting of the positions of the gear change lever.
 

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Easier clutch control with hand. The hand has more dexterity than the foot, plus you can anchor your hand with the thumb for more control.
At the same time if your just learning, bikes are just more dangerous.
For example, too much throttle and letting the clutch out too fast: Car = rear wheel spin
Bike = wheelie
I crashed in my first lesson in parking lot of the dealer. But hey I started off doing a stunt. A 20 foot long wheelie! Followed by a nice scenic trip over the bars. Luckily I started on dual purpose 250 and no damage. To the bike.
 

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Scott is right about the amazing hands compared to the clumbs & often overpowering feet due to leg muscles.

So in a way the most important things being Throttle, Clutch, & Front Brakes are under the control of our hands & not the dumb feet while it is only up or down with the gear change lever, & pressind down on the rear brake pedal. Making the reaction time & control superior to the cage drivers.

Like when I am in town or city & when I have cages close to me on the hwys my hands ALSO cover the clutch & front brake levers for that fraction of a second faster in stopping time can mean the difference between stopping or slowing down in time compared to hitting the cage that cuts you off or suddenly locks up its wheels.

We learned this when road racing with 2-strokes for often when slip-streaming them while on a 4-stroke in skelton form, of the 50s to 70s we had to be within inches compared to these days, only suddenly the darn 2-stroke would lock up with a piston or all pistons welding to the bbl. So our stopping in time was touch & go. In a while the 2-stroke riders & 4-stroke racers, as well, would be close to each other or flat out in revs & covering the levers with both hands!!!!!!!

ALSO when in Observed Trials one is always on top of their front brake & clutch levers to stay "feet-up" (in other world to stay "clean" or to make it through said section without dabbing a foot) in the sections. Well that was the intent anyway for those with the least dabs was the winner.
 

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Personaly I think everyone should learn to drive a manual car before getting there license. They must pass there D/L test on a manual car. I thinkt this would make bad drivers better. JMO though.
 

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ScottF3 said:
Smitty makes an excellent point too, the sync. gearbox on motorcycles (and race cars) makes the whole process much easier as well.
I think you mean sequential gearboxes. Almost all gearboxes have synchros now (except for some tractor trailers). It is true that most modern race cars are equipped with sequential gearboxes, but the rally cars you see on TV actually have conventional gearboxes with electronic shifting (see tiptronic below). Formula 1 and other prototype cars and most race cars you see in production series such as Trans Am actually have sequential gearboxes. To make matters even more confusing, some people think tiptronic transmissions on some modern "sporty" cars are sequential. They are in fact automatic transmissions that behave a little bit like sequential manuals, but there are important differences in performance, such a noticable lag. Now, who wants to hear about electronic shifters for sequential gearboxes a la in superbike and F1? :eyebrows:
 

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I am in the middle of my MSF class and we had our first day of riding today, and my first time ever on a motorcycle. I drive a manual transmission car. I'm sure this helps me out a lot with the bike, but I have to say, even for someone who has never ridden a bike before, shifting is much easier on a bike. Just up or down. That's it. No looking at a shift map on the back of the shift lever knob or anything like that. Up to upshift, down to downshift, it's very intuitive.
 

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Having a few friends who are learning how to ride, makes me realize that the first skill one must master on a bike is the clutch. a good clutch hand will save you from most parking lot problems. a bad clutch hand will put the asphalt uncomfortably close to your face. (next probyl comes the brakes, after that some throttle skills, and then body positioning... i dont know what after that couse i am still working on getting my body to position itself right consistently)

seriosly thou, practive the clutch and it will save you road rash.


now that i think about it, how did i ever learn to ride? i think i did ok couse i didnt realize how scary that is.
 

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i bought my first man car and my first bike 4 days apart... i learned on them oth at the same time... i got the bike down MUCH easier though, prolly cause of the fact that the hand is more dexterious then the foot...
 

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i learned to ride bikes before i had learned to drive stick on a car. knowing the concept of 'friction zone', and how the clutch can also be used a brake helped me out lot when learning to drive stick. i remeber it was a messy process learning on a bike. as such, i picked up stick pretty fast. i'd image the same would go if you had learned on a car first. :)

in know in Sweden all drivers ed classes are taught w/stick shift. and when you take the test for your liscense, you have to drive stick. they should so do that in the USA also :)

-chr|s sedition
 
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