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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey all, I need a little help if you wouldn't mind. Here's my situation, and keep in mind I'm gonna show this to my cousin when I get some decent replies. You'll understand when I'm done.

Anyway: My cousin, 21, just bought his first bike in July. It's a '93 Kawasaki Ninja ZX-6E. I like the bike. Nothing compared to my F4, but that's to be expected. Anyway it is a nice bike. PLENTY fast enough for a beginner. Thing is, since I don't ride and won't be again 'til this Spring, his only input comes from Squids, which dominate the riding population here in Youngstown. The kid rides without insurance, no helmet, no license("but I have my permit..."), and wants to be a friggin' Starboy. Yeah, he's slowly evolving into the darkness loving sea creature, if he hasn't already. Thing is, he' WAY too unsure on the bike, and I guarantee that he will be dead if he doesn't slow down.

Now for my issue: His riding "friends" told him he should get a GSXR750 or a Honda 900 because he's too slow and can't ride wheelies. I tell him, "Shawn, stay on your bike and learn IT first. I can ride it better than you can right now, and I've only ridden it once or twice". Well, he doesn't seem to listen. It's true though. My g/f and I took it for a few and I was scrapin' hard parts 2-minutes into the ride. He's never even touched down on the thing. I say, he should master that bike, then buy another newer 600. As for his a$$hole friends, if he listens to me and masters HIS ride, he'll be outrunnin' and outcornerin' them in no time.

What I need is some support, which I will print and show my cousin. I don't want him to be another statistic. I need you all to give him some advice, let him know what's BAD about getting a 750 or a 900 and let him know what's good about mastering his bike. I know that he can ride well if he gives it time. He can outrun his little punk friends too if he's patient. Please help me out here guys/gals. Thanks a lot...

Onward fellas!!!
 
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First of all that is bull shit ! A zx6-e can wheelie for daysz! The key is shifting ;) (Its true though)

If he want's to be a starboy let him , It's better to f**k up a stoppie, then take a bad line on a country back road and hit a car.

If he does want to learn how to ride, Prepare him.. Send him to racing school.. Give him the skills he needs to survive. Then , He and only he can make the decision if he want's to be a squid.

I would not let him buy a bigger bike, That bike is way to big for him now. Let me show him a few tricks with his bike and he'll wanna keep it ;) Promise :)
 
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You should tell him about Mongrel Racing, I remember reading that he trading in his TLR for an SV650, and he's faster now ...(Correct me if Im wrong) .. Perfect example ?
 

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You guys are not helping Nick's cause at all here.

I totally agree Nick, and being king squid myself :D I know that I would be road pizza if I didn't know how to handle the bike in all aspects. Doing wheelies and stoppies can put you into a situation where you need good riding skills to get your ass out of trouble.

Definitely learn how to ride first!! The rest will come much more naturally. I think that his friends are not at all intouch with reality or concerned about his life. I've seen and heard of way too f*ckin many fatals this year and some too close to home I don't want to hear about anymore.
 

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Nick, I feel for ya man. Enjoy your cousin's company now while he's still here, because if he buys a GSXR750 or such; I doubt he'll be around much longer. Peer pressure is a bitch, and has no business on sportbike. I would venture to say that doing something on a sportbike because of peer pressure could be more dangerous than riding drunk. Save the stunts and "Starboyz" crap for later when you can actually ride that thing. Wear all your gear all the time, and hit as many track days as you can afford. I believe the real satisfaction in our sport doesn't come from mile long wheelies or rolling stoppies, but carving that perfect corner with your knee blazing across the asphalt(on the track of course). The best thing is; you can do all of this on your perfectly good ZX-6 for years to come.
 

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Hey there Amigo...

If I were anywhere close to ya'll I gladly take your cousin on a little trip around the E.R. Perhaps if he saw first hand how nasty an open break in the skin is, with say, your femur sticking outta your thigh looks... Then maybe he'd change his mind about trying to impress a bunch of Squids...

The blood, it's everywhere... The big stong men turn into wimpering, screaming, little boyz... They are in pain, for about 1.5 hours at best b/c nonone knows if you are allergic to morophine... Ya can't get out of bed once your all stiched up so some lovely person comes along and sticks a catheter in your *enis so you can pee... Hopefully you won't get an infection from this which means a longer stay in the hosiptal. Then there's rehab... If you've f**ked yourself up really good cuz you were pulling a monster wheelie and hit a car... Well, walking may just be something you have to learn to do again.... Your muscles waste away like you wouldn't believe after only a week of laying in bed... You loose like 15-25% of your strength due to atrophy...

I could scan in pics of people who hit the back of vans on motorcycles and weren't wearing a helmet... Their faces were flattened, their noses are recessed back into their craniums... Just check out Rotten.com and I am sure you'll come across one or two bad motorcycle accidents...

I could go on but I am sure someone else can cover the other important issues like money wasted after trashing a new bike, how your not really cool when you dump your bike trying to wheelie, how not having a license b/c of dangerous driving sucks, how most chicks don't dig a limp even if it is from a motorcycle accident, how killing or hurting other people b/c you had to show off in front of your friends really isn't worth the risk of not looking cool, how scrubing pebbles out of your hands isn't all that plesant cuz your awake and frankly you deserve the pain (not too nurse like of me)... How crapy it is to go to your friend funeral, or to hear that someone on a bike has died and for that person to be YOU. I've lost 3 on bikes... Two doing things they shouldn't have... It's all the same, death is FINAL and it sucks... But go ahead and do that yo your family.. Cuz after all... You'll look really cool...

Kirsty
 

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Well said Kristy....Nick tell you cousin he needs to find some new friends to ride with. Hell he'd be better off learning from a bunch of old guys who've been riding for years. Thats what I did. If his dumba$$ friends knew anything about riding they'd know that any modern 600 is more than powerful enough to ride a mile long wheelie on if you do it right. Not that I recommend doing things like that on the road. I think he definately needs to wear the proper gear first, then get his license, then take a riding school. At least enroll him in the MSF course.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Re: You're not fooling us!

Thanks all for your help and keep it coming, cause that's what I wanted from this thread. You're all helping already.

Any misconceptions because of Paul are false. Oh well...anyway, this is about my cousin, and I just don't wanna see him hurt. Thanks to all of you. You're all awesome.

[Edited by CBR Brutha on 11-09-2000 at 07:01 AM]
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
RC51racer said:
I think he definately needs to wear the proper gear first, then get his license, then take a riding school. At least enroll him in the MSF course.
Yeah, my next step is to try and convince him that he ought to take the MSF course. The beginner course, then the expert. I think he'd benefit from both. I am gonna show him all the posts in this thread, and I think he'll really start to listen to me because of them. Thanks again...

[Edited by CBR Brutha on 11-09-2000 at 07:20 AM]
 
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CBR Brutha said:
RC51racer said:
I think he definately needs to wear the proper gear first, then get his license, then take a riding school. At least enroll him in the MSF course.
Yeah, my next step is to try and convince him that he ought to take the MSF course. The beginner course, then the expert. I think he'd benefit from both. I am gonna show him all the posts in this thread, say for Paul's useless one (Is it true that some guys buy Ducatis because they have small *enises?:)), and I think he'll really start to listen to me because of them. Thanks again...

He didn't take an MSF course ?? C'mon man, Can you beat your cousin up ? Cause if he won't go Kick his ass (literally) ...
 

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Re: Re: You're not fooling us!

CBR Brutha said:
...Hey Paul, you're a di-k. And PLEASE notice the lack of smillies....
Thanks Nick! I'll accept that as a compliment!

As for having a problem with you? Not at all. Sorry if your crank got bent. I got nuthin' but love for ya' Brutha!
 

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Nick- This is for your cousin:
To reiterate what's already been said:
Get and wear the proper gear-helmet,gloves, jacket, boots...
Take the MSF course, and eventually track days or school...
Take it easy for a while- learn how to ride, how your own bike handles, where your limits are, and how to approach them safely...This takes longer than you think.

It kills me how much people give in to peer pressure and get the biggest and baddest things around, just because their friends say so. Hell if I did that, I'd be driving a Lexus, riding a Hayabusa, wearing nothing but Tommy, Fubu and Ralph, living in a cardboard box, but hey at least I'd look cool. You got to do what's good for you, not what other people tell you.

Learn how to ride the bike you have. It's fast enough and it's pretty likely that you'll never get to its limits. If you do, you might want to take up roadracing. If you want to learn how to do tricks, buy a dirtbike and ride that for a while. Cheaper, easier to do wheelies, stoppies, power slides, etc.

In the end, nobody looks cool in the hospital, or with a broken, scuffed up, trashed bike caused by trying to impress your friends.

I'm done.
 

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Ok, I owned my ZX6E for less than 8 months. I rode pretty damn "hard" on occaision, and knew the bike had alot more to give. The 6E is a bit of a slug, bulky, overweight, etc. But it has very good power for its vintage. It handles nice and is alot more comfortable than most newer ss model middlewieght bikes.

Tell him to keep the bike for at least a year, maybe 2. He shouldnt move up in class until he is absolutely ready. I know for a fact that if my 6E didnt get totalled id still be riding it happily and would not think of buying something else probably for the next 2 years. And ive been riding SPORTbikes since 1992.

HE NEEDS TO WEAR A HELMET, GLOVES AND FOOTWEAR THAT COVERS HIS ANKLES.

These 3 things are , in my opinion, the most important protective gear we all should wear. a bit of road rash can heal, but head damage, foot damage or hand damage are things that are infinately more serious. A jacket is just being THAT MUCH smarter. If he is riding without a helmet, it doesnt matter what you tell him, he isjust a friggin MORON. That should be goal one.

[Edited by GreenNinja on 11-09-2000 at 07:19 AM]
 

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Not being able to ride a wheelie on a ZX6 is most definitely a lack of technique (skill) and not a need for more power. More power will get the front up easier but in my opinion it makes it harder for the inexperienced to ride the wheelie because everything you do is magnified. I personally could ride much longer wheelies on my 80some horsepower F2 than I can on my 140some horesepower XX. It comes down to two things. First, you can't learn nearly as fast on a bike that intimidates you. If you're not smart enough to be intimidated by the likes of a new gixxer750 or 900RR, you will most likely die or put yourself in a wheelchair. Or far worse, kill or mame an innocent bystander while convincing the people that hate our sport that they are right. Keep it up squids and see how long it takes politicians to take notice and take away our rides for good.

I think he needs to watch some pro 600 supersport races. After one race I once saw Duhamel ride a 1/4 mile wheelie which included a mild corner and then launch a HUGE rolling crossed up stoppie with his ass pointed at the crowd. I don't know how fast he started the stoppie at but he rode it like that for a long way. This was done on a race course by someone that was obviously in TOTAL control so don't think I am advocating this kind of activity on public roads. That means you too chris_y2k_r1 :D:D.

The point is that the 600's are MORE than capable. Any idiot can buy a megapowerfull bike, twist the grip, launch the front wheel, and then hope nobody notices he's shitting his pants for half a block until he can get it back down (hopefully not hitting a parked car). It's exhibitions of CONTROL and SKILL that are admired and respected, not exhibitions of power. You can only get that from hours and hours and hours of practice and experience, not by getting more power. You WILL crash when trying to learn this stuff. There is no question of that. That's why people spend big dollars on protective gear. It's going to happen you just have to prepare yourself for it. A more powerfull bike just makes sure that these crashes happen at higher speeds with more serious consequences.

I speak from experience, unfortunately. I've had "The big one" and I am lucky to be alive. I also have a personal friend that bought more power because he couldn't keep up on the weekend ride. He's in a wheelchair for the rest of his life.

Make sure your cousin understands that these responses aren't meant to be condescending. But we all know someone that this has happened to and we just want to make sure that he can enjoy this sport as safely as possible. As far as keeping up with the group goes, believe me the fast guys would rather wait a couple minutes at the next turn off than spend their afternoon waiting for the ambulance, holding your hand, and trying to tell you everything is going to be OK. That's all I have to say.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Re: Re: Re: You're not fooling us!

748_abuser said:
As for having a problem with you? Not at all. Sorry if your crank got bent. I got nuthin' but love for ya' Brutha!
Paul, I just edited my previous posts in light of this one from you. It just seems like you're always a smart-a$$ to me no matter what the topic. Kinda gets annoying. Maybe that's just your personality, or maybe I just took it the wrong way. Anyway, thanks for clearing things up, and notice the thread edits I just did. Thanks bro...ride on...and if you can help with this thread, please do. I need all the help I can get when it comes to Shawn (my cousin). He is easily swayed by peer pressure, and the last thing I wanna see is another rider go down.
 

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Hey Brutha,
I hope your cousin is taking all this in. This is good information and it's coming from great sources. I have run into this same type of situation with a friend of mine. It's difficult to make a person understand that you are doing this because you don't want them to get hurt unecessarily. Explain to him that you and most others here have been down the road he's traveling. No pun intended. I agree with everyone else here, he shouldn't move into the big-bore bikes yet. Liter-class bikes are not as forgiving with beginner's mistakes; and he will make mistakes. The difference is, at this stage, he would have a much better chance of being able to get out of trouble if he makes a mistake on a 6 than if he were on a liter bike. Just my opinion. Hope this helps.
 

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Based on your posts Nick, I doubt that your cousin is much for listening to you. If he does listen then this has all been great advice but since he probably doesn't... :(

You might have to use a little psychology on him. Try to arrange a ride with him and his friends. Then prove to him that his bike is capable of beating his friends' bigger bikes. He should get off on kicking the shit out of the bigger bikes. You of course will need to figure out how he can go riding but with you on his bike. I'm sure you don't want him on yours. :D This idea is kind of related to the idea of Mongrel being faster on his SV650 vs his TL1000. In the tight stuff, I am faster on my wife's SV than my RC 51. Bigger is not always better.

Also, you may want to offer to go with him to the MSF course. You could just take it with him. :)
 

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well this thread pretty much explains it all.. i just want to add that i crashed w/a helmet, leather jacket, gloves, & my brand new airwalks... some road rash.. a slight head ache, a broken femur & a foot that was anhilated.. my dream since grade school was to be a soldier.. 95% chance i wont ever realize my dream.

get your cousin on this forum. at the very least print it out & give copies to him, your aunt & your uncle... hell if worst comes to worst call his local police & rat him out on the insurance & license.
 

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Phreak, thats right about the foot thing. i mentioned it in my other post because i can tell you right now, if i had had a pair of Airwalks on, my left ankle would be ground down past the bone.

What i WAS wearing was a $250.00 pair of Italian Raichle Hiking boots. Gore-Tex and leather with plenty of ankle protection. The Gore-Tex and underlying heavy fiber insulating material underneith on the ankle area were rashed through probably 50%. I am greatful for not being a "sneakers" rider.

(BTW, Al Gore is NOT the father of Gore Tex)

;)
 
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