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Ok i admit it, i only got about 1/4 of the way through. But that sounds terrible. All that just to make money.
 

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"Casualty Reduction"

What a depressing read, neafearjustbeer. :eek:

Good thing the U.S. is just too big for the cops / speed cameras to cover all the roads. Same thing for the Aussies and Canadians, I think. Not that I'd put such extreme measures past our own local or higher governments if they thought they could pull off.

What a shame that the government feels the need to dip into everyone's pockets in the name of "casualty reduction". I'm sure the dishonesty of that approach (instead of a straight up raise in taxes if that's what's needed) and the disruption to people's lives caused by this invasiveness is what rankles.

Well, what can you do ? Lobby your politicians, swamp the courts by everyone fighting it with "not guilty" pleas, citizen's revolt such as trashing the cameras Boston Tea Party style ? I think if your 27 million road users could band together somehow and let the authorities know you won't stand for it, they'd back off.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
The problem is when a new camera is installed somewhere and it is hidden from view.
A story reported in the paper a while back about this guy who got caught every day of the week on his way to work and recieved a ban, he was not driving particularily fast but still lost his license. The thing is it takes about 14 days for the ticket to get posted to you and by the time he got the first one it was too late.The rest were already on the way.
Over here we have points system on your licence, 12 points and you are banned. Each speeding ticket will give you a minimum of 3 points and these points stay on your licence for 4 years. Things like drink driving are an imediate minimum years ban and will stay on your licence for 10 years. Which you would deserve for drink driving .

But for driving 15mph over the limit on a motorway it is crazy, these cameras do not take into account weather and road conditions. So somebody driving at 70mph in the snow would not collect a ticket but someone driving at 85mph on an empty dry road would. Crazy if you ask me!
 

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naefear, A little birdie told me the actual value of the cameras in those is 5k, and they go for up to 1k to certain people :)


Don't clog the courts, just angle grind them till they stop breaking even :)
 

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We just got our first permanent speed camera in my general area. Its on a dead straight, wide road in the middle of an industrial area.
Now will that piece of shit camera stop the bitch in the van from trying to run me over again. Or the silly old crone who hit the rear of my bike when I was at stop lights.
I know it won't stop the local hoons because the camera sticks out like a turd in a punch bowl.
When did policing become mindless ticket vending instead of serious crime prevention..:finger: :finger: :finger: :finger:
 

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I read on here ,about a year ago, that they put up speed cameras somewere in Texas ,and within a week all the cameras were shot out. :twofinger
 

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BobbyDazzler said:
We just got our first permanent speed camera in my general area. Its on a dead straight, wide road in the middle of an industrial area.
Now will that piece of shit camera stop the bitch in the van from trying to run me over again. Or the silly old crone who hit the rear of my bike when I was at stop lights.
I know it won't stop the local hoons because the camera sticks out like a turd in a punch bowl.
When did policing become mindless ticket vending instead of serious crime prevention..:finger: :finger: :finger: :finger:
Well said Doctor!
 

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The tried the cameras in BC, Canada, for a couple years, then pulled them last year (or the year before). The studies they did showed that they werent generating as much revenue as calculated so they ditched them.

A lot of people took the tickets to court if there was even the slightest hint or blur on them. In fact a years worth of all tickets taken at the start had something wrong with them, so if you disputed them they got thrown out. Of course you had to dispute them, and if you didnt you still had to pay. Made a lot of sense, how much did all the court time cost in disputing them compared to the ones that paid.

The time it takes to get a ticket is stupid as well. When a person gets a ticket, evn a warning, it puts them in a different mind set. They slow down, think over thier driving some more (usually), etc. But on a single trip with cameras, you could get caught 5 times and dinged for them all without learning anything but what its like to loose your license.

Personal law enforcement will always beat cameras. Even with a pig headed cop on a rampage you can still at least attempt to reason with him ;p
 

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BobbyDazzler said:
We just got our first permanent speed camera in my general area. Its on a dead straight, wide road in the middle of an industrial area.
Now will that piece of shit camera stop the bitch in the van from trying to run me over again. Or the silly old crone who hit the rear of my bike when I was at stop lights.
I know it won't stop the local hoons because the camera sticks out like a turd in a punch bowl.
When did policing become mindless ticket vending instead of serious crime prevention..:finger: :finger: :finger: :finger:

It's a bitch what a 22-250 will do about 500yds away.:cool:
 

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Crius: Have you noticed the latest dream the B.C. Govt has?

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STORY
Speeders targeted for bigger penalties
Excessive speeders face double demerit points

Jeremy Sandler [Sound Off]
Vancouver Sun

Saturday, June 22, 2002
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The B.C. government is getting set to increase fines and double the number of demerit points issued for traffic offences such as excessive speeding.

Solicitor-General Rich Coleman confirmed Friday the Liberal cabinet is looking at a dramatic hike in the penalties applied to those convicted of driving more than 40 km/h over posted limits.

Fines for excessive speeding are currently anywhere from $345 to $460, plus three demerit points. Coleman said the government is proposing to double the number of demerit points handed out, but cabinet has not yet decided on how big the fine increases should be.

The hike in demerit points will mean drivers will automatically have to pay a demerit premium levied by ICBC of at least $300, in addition to their ticket costs.

No premium is currently levied against drivers with three or fewer demerit points, but under the new system, just one excessive speeding conviction would mean six points and a $300 bill.

Coleman said the initiative is aimed at making roads safer.

"Excessive speed at the top levels is one of the biggest contributors to serious and fatal motor vehicle accidents," he said.

Coleman said the move is not a cash grab on the part of the government.

"This is not a significant impact on revenues. This is an impact on certain people going at a certain speed that they are putting their lives and others in danger," he said.

Coleman added that the fine increase would not apply to other offences, such as speeders going less than 40 km/h over posted limits. The fines for speeding that is not deemed "excessive" currently range from $115 to $230, plus three demerit points.

"None of the other categories would change," Coleman said.

But Michael Cain, research director for Safety by Education Not Speed Enforcement (SENSE), a lobby group that originally fought the use of photo radar in B.C., said the government needs to look at increasing speed limits on some roads before it hikes fines for excessive speeding.

"What they're trying to do is fight street racing," Cain said. "These increased fines are not going to represent a deterrent to wealthy street racers, but they are going to be an exceedingly high fine on some drivers who are caught ... where speed limits are posted too low."

Cain said the B.C. government should have to prove the reasonableness of posted speed limits, as is done in some U.S. jurisdictions. If a speed limit cannot be shown as reasonable, drivers exceeding it may not be ticketed.

Cain also said demerit points should be issued on a sliding scale, so that one or two lesser speeding offences would not result in whopping demerit charges.

"What the government should be doing is making the lowest level of speeding, which is zero to 20 [km/h over the limit], a two-point offence, leaving the 20-40 as three points, and 40-60 would be four points and 60-over would be five points," he said. "That would then be a graduated points system."

Inspector Don Saigle, the officer in charge of traffic services for the RCMP in B.C., said police forces around the province have been contacted about the government's plan. He thinks the government's initiative is a good one.

"I think this is one of the administrative sanctions that can be imposed to assist the driving public in recognizing the inappropriateness of that type of behaviour," he said. "If people violate their privilege of operating a vehicle, then there needs to be an expectation that there is some punitive action that will follow as a result."

University of Ottawa criminology professor Julian Roberts, an expert on sentencing issues, expects the plan will reduce the total amount of excessive speeding.

"People are fairly sensitive to the penalty for driving offences," he said. "So I would say increasing the penalty, increasing the fine, would have a deterrent effect."

But Roberts added convincing people they're going to get caught is equally important to the stiffness of the penalty in modifying behaviour.

"The fine for jumping a red light could be $10,000, but it's not going to deter people if they don't think they're gong to get caught," he said. "You need to have a stiff fine and you need to convince people that ... there is a reasonable probability of being caught."

DRIVERS' FINES AND DEMERITS

Each traffic offence committed by B.C. drivers calls for certain fines and demerit points. Below are selected Motor Vehicle Act offences, listed with their related fines and driver penalty points.

Every B.C. driver who accumulates four or more driver penalty points must pay a driver penalty premium in order to renew his or here licence. The money goes to ICBC, which uses it to reduce premium costs for drivers. The more points a driver accumulates, the more it costs to renew a licence.

Driver penalty point (DPP) premium chart

Driver Point

Penalty Premium $

0-3 Nil

4 $175

5 $230

6 $300

7 $415

8 $520

9 $640

10 $905

20 $3,760

30 $8,160

40 $14,560

50 or more $24,000

Offense

Drive contrary to restriction (e.g., not wearing corrective lenses)

Fine $86

Points 3

Fail to produce driver's licence or insurance

Fine $58

Points 0

Fail to yield to pedestrian

Fine $144

Points 2

Drive without due care

Fine $345

Points 6

Speed in school zone

Fine $173-230

Points 3

Fail to stop for school bus

Fine $144

Points 3

Change lanes without signal

Fine $86

Points 2

Disobey stop sign

Fine $144

Points 3

U-turn - intersection

Fine $144

Points 2

Pass on right

Fine $86

Points 2
© Copyright 2002 Vancouver Sun
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Doesnt really surprise me too much. This is after all the Screw You province. It seems excessively taxing us is just the norm, so they just jack the price up on everything else.
At christmas time in BC I was paying about 5 bucks a pack for smokes. I bought a pack yesterday and it was $7.60, real nice increase. These changes just keep pouring in and people really have no recourse with it. Why? No one in power ever listens to anyone here. Been like that forever, will stay like that. And if by some devine miracle something does change, its because there is a bigger and better plan to screw people around. Photo radar gone? No problem, because we are going to hike speeding fines up anyways.
The speed limits here are idiotic at best, especially up in the interior. So many spots that anyone with a half firing neuron could drive on with 80 or 90 kmh posted limits. One particular spot was at 70 kmh where it should have been at 100. Now its up to 90, but that only took ten years to correct.
Crap like the above posted just reaffirms that this province has gone to hell and it wont be coming back. And people wonder why I plan to leave asap.
 

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In actual fact ANOTHER one I worry about -----

-----is the new B.C. Provincial Govt had pretty well promised to hand the Govt owned Insurance business over to private insurance firms. The private insurance people have been kept out for something like 30 yrs or more & they will hike prices beyond belief.
This is the one reason I will not sell my '87 Yamaha TZR-250. Chances are the cost of the 600 & my 929 will be to high.
Ah for the past when I never carried any insurance & most police cars did not have wireless --- the time some of us owned fast trotting 1000cc V-twins churned out by Vincent HRD!!!!
 

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Having some different insurance agents would actually drive down the price I think. Since the only one now has held a monopoly for so long, these new insurance people will want to undercut them big time to draw away business, forcing them to lower thier rates to compete.
As for current insurance, on my 84 FJ I dont find it too bad hehe. With my 43% roadstar discount, I pay 500 a year for it all. It just really jumps when you break that 750cc mark when insurance starts getting jumpy. And if you dont have a good driving record with big discounts ;p
 

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Do not forget also that ICBC rates are not varied for the age and drivers risk factor - the only variation is the extra premium penalty for claims. Therefore in a most unfair manner the high risk groups like women aged early twenties or teenage boys pay ridiculously low premiums at the expense of other older drivers who are penalized.

The whole ICBC business is run like a mafia really.
 

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I think they just passed legislation to the effect that, All speed cameras had to be clearly visible, and they could only be positioned in areas where there is some type of incident history.
I can't find the actual magazine article, but that was the jist of it.
 

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I just saw something that made sense that the RCMP are doing in the lower mainland.
In a lot of the high risk areas, and many more, they now have a different type of speedtrap running. It has a large board displaying the speed you are traveling as you pass it. What its meant to do is let you know your speed so you can do one of two things: slow it down or keep speeding so the officers down the road pull you over and ticket you.
In my mind its a good thing. If you are speeding and just weren't paying attention (who hasn't looked down and seen thier speed well in excess and not noticed it) its like a mental poke to get you back on track. Whenever you are pulled over and get away with a warning, it makes you think more about how you are driving and keep a watch on it. Seeing something like this would be the same equivalent. Maybe this would be a better way to incorporate photo radar. Nailing the people who just don't care enough to be responsible. Could even vary how far away the camera or officer is, be it right around the corner of 3 or 4 clicks away, if there even is one if all they want to do is make people slow down and think.
 

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Such a portable unit ---

--- was handed out to a concened citizen, by the RCMP, in a school zone close to my home. He/she had children attending that school.
So many dump/working trucks were scooting along at 40 to 60KPH (speed limit is 30KPH in school zones). No police around, but within a week most vehicles were down to 29 to 32KPH for most felt the police were around & this citizen DID turn in license plates, times, & speeds, to RCMP, so warning letters went out to them.
 
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