Gunman kills 1, wounds 15 at school near San Diego

As most of you know. I work for a school district.

With all of this shit going on the past two years I am starting to think I would have been safer staying in the Army.

Full Story:
http://www.cnn.com/2001/US/03/05/sch....02/index.html

Detroit high school shooting injures 3
February 2, 2001
Student dies after shooting outside Baltimore high school
January 17, 2001
Student killed in Michigan elementary school shooting
February 29, 2000
Suspect in custody after school shooting in Oklahoma
December 6, 1999


This is an all too common occurance these days.

it seems like everyones trying to get attention like that nowadays.. when I was in school, the troubled ones just put soap in the fountains and pulled the fire alarms... I'm glad I don't have any kids for fear of this all....

This is what happens when discipline goes out the window. Children today have no respect for anything but MTV. A bulletin for you young parents: That timeout in the corner bullshit doesn't work.
It is refreshing to know that they are killing each other off before they become a real burden on society.

When they start locking up the parents of the gun toting losers then the guns will be better protected.

Parents of today(typically) are not doing their job. They want the schools to raise their kids but not discipline them. Big mistake.

Just a bunch of little punk ass Puff Daddy/Marilyn Manson wannabes.

It's a vicious cycle. The more publicized these things are, the more likely another is going to happen. It's too bad these kids can't see that whatever they think is soooo important right now (like feeling inferior to the athletes or whatever) isn't worth ruining your life or especially others'.

"A bulletin for you young parents: That timeout in the corner bullshit doesn't work.
It is refreshing to know that they are killing each other off before they become a real burden on society. "


I agree, the timeout is a load of Psycho-babble bullshit. Unfortunately, society has bought off on it and told parents that it's unacceptable to spank your child. Especially while I was in the Nave, I talked with several parents that were in a world of shit by the Family Protective services (read: Nazi's) for simply trying to disipline their children. I do agree that many parents do let there children run wild; but I think in this world of single parent families, the roles of a parent have changed considerably from the time the baby boomers grew up in. No more Leave it to Beaver. The Beev has a Tek-9 now!

True-er words have never been spoken. These types of incidents will not end if parents don't start actually raising their kids. This "non-discipline" is just bulls*t, but peaople are acually promoting lame parenting.

A sad but true example: After my divorce my ex asked if I would meet with the kids(9 and 5) and a shrink. She was unable to control the kids and thought it was my fault. She is against spanking and physical punishment. I believe in it as long as it's appropriate. The shrink lectured me on the evils of physical punishment, and "provoked my young boy into a tantrum. He then demonstrated the propper way to control a childs outbursts. He pinned my sons arms and legs to the floor and rested his body weight on top of him to restrain him. My son went beserk, and coughing and saying he couldn't breath(the fat bastard weighs about 230lbs). I grabbed him off my son and proceded to inform him of the consequences of placing his hands on one of my children again. To me that was far more abusive than a spanking ever could be.

Side note......It's not a good idea to "explain" things to a shrink when you are going through a divorce. It almost came back to haunt me in court later.

Some of you guys got it all wrong about that "time out" routine of disciplining children. I have an 11-year old which I used time out as a punishment and it worked like a dream. How do I know? My kid is as good as they come. Responsible, get's great grades in school, does chores, doesn't talk back, nothing I can complain about. The secret to time out being effective is when you back it up with positive reinforcement when they do good. Give them the right type of attention. Let them know you care about EVERYTHING that happens to them. Show them how much you love them when they're good. I guarantee you, when you do that, then you take it away by giving them time out, it devastates them to the point where they will do the good things just to please you. Those parents that used time out and it didn't work....that's because they rarely paid attention to their kids when they did well. So what difference does it make? The key is paying attention. The key is caring about your children. Do that from day one until they're 8 or 9. After that, the foundation is set and they will know right and wrong. They'll be so afraid to let you down because they just want to keep you happy. It's a tough balancing act but it can be done effectively if parents put enough time and effort. Isn't that a concept! Put time and effort in raising your kids. This is afterall the most important thing you will ever do in your entire life. You can screw up your job. Screw up your finances. Screw yourself up. But by God, don't screw up raising your kids!

I remember when I was a kid and my parents spanked me. Each time that leather belt hit my butt, I felt pain. But more than that, I felt anger. And as I got older, say around 8 and I got spanked, I just didn't cry anymore and instead I rebelled. Spanking wasn't much of a deterrent. Ask me how I deal with things NOW when I get upset...my first reaction is to lash out and hit something. Something to do with all the spanking I would imagine. Thank God I was able to suppress that when I was raising my kid. Spanking children won't guarantee they'll grow up happy and well adjusted either. All we know is using pain as a discipline tool is counterproductive when you're trying to raise responsible, loving human beings. If you give them enough pain, both mental & physical, they will likely lash out someday. Like animals who are physically abused then lash out at their masters or just go berserk killing everything in sight. Ever seen those on TV with elephants & Lions???!!! Why would you inflict phsical & emotional pain on someone you love just because they misbehaved? I believe time out, when balanced with caring and positive attention works the way it was intended to: raise happy, loving, responsible adults.

Sorry for the long rant.

Rouge Biker,

I hear you and even agree to some extent BUT... being third of seven kids myself and having three of my own now with the youngest at 15, I can assure you that different kids respond differently to the same treatment. The trick is knowing which one, when, and how much. Out of my parent's seven, with the youngest at 35 now, they didn't have one miss. Every one of them is tops in their field, get along with ANYBODY, and genuinely nice, honest, fun people. I for one, got some physical persuasion now and then and damn well needed it. With my kids now, I've only resorted to physical on rare occasions. I can count the times on two hands with fingers to spare, and so far so good. Actually, they're old enough now that if they don't have it yet, they aren't going to get it. The spanking days, when it can be effective, are long gone. I had one who needed a little, one who needed none, and one who knew how to get right to the edge, but quit in time. They're all pretty independant and doing fine. One thing, regardless of how you handle it, they have to know that you care.

This is a sad story. You have to wonder if they are trying to get attention. People should relize that the media blows events like this up just so they can get ratings. These are enormous attention getters and also put the ideas into some peoples heads. We have to wonder why these kids are able to come to this point. Were his parents neglegent or were his surroundings hostile, or both? Why?

I like to be informed about things but not to that point.