Murder or Manslaughter? Your thoughts??? - Sportbike Forum: Sportbike Motorcycle Forums
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 12-12-2005, 10:58 AM Thread Starter
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Question Murder or Manslaughter? Your thoughts???

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Father cleared of murdering ill son

A British man who admitted smothering his terminally ill 10-year-old son was found not guilty of murder today, prompting an angry response from the boy's mother who condemned the verdict.

Andrew Wragg, 37, had said he was not of sound mind when he killed his son Jacob, who suffered from the rare inherited condition Hunter's Syndrome.

The former special forces soldier was given a two year suspended sentence after he admitted a lesser charge of manslaughter at Lewes Crown Court.

After killing Jacob in July 2004, Wragg dialled emergency services to say he had carried out a "mercy killing" but prosecutors argued he had simply been overwhelmed by the responsibility of looking after his son.

Wragg's former wife Mary, who was the primary carer for the boy, said she was appalled by the sentence.

"Jacob was a happy, loving child living in a sometimes difficult body. He never lost his sense of fun and those who understood him really loved Jacob for being Jacob," she told reporters outside the court.

"It has been extremely difficult to sit and listen as the dignity of my little boy has been destroyed in an effort to reduce the impact of his death.

"Jacob's condition has been used as an excuse for this crime and I find it appalling that anyone would try and portray him as being less deserving of his life or less entitled to enjoy every precious moment his condition allowed."

She said the case had raised many issues for other families caring for terminally ill children.

"I am shocked by the sentence and the message it sends to others," she said.

During the trial, jurors heard that Wragg smothered Jacob after Mary left the boy alone in the family house in Worthing, on the south coast.

Wragg had stood trial for murder earlier in 2005 but the case collapsed in March after the jury failed to reach a verdict.



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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 12-12-2005, 04:51 PM
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Sounds like murder 1 to me.

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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 12-12-2005, 09:40 PM
 
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its a bit hard to say, but if he wasn't the primary care taker, he shouldn't have taken the kid's life, no matter if it was his son or a 'mercy kill'.
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 12-13-2005, 04:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by JBaz
its a bit hard to say, but if he wasn't the primary care taker, he shouldn't have taken the kid's life, no matter if it was his son or a 'mercy kill'.
It doesn't matter who the primary care giver was, nobody should be able to take another person's life. It's not hard to say at all, IMO. This is a very black and white issue to me. I say hang the father. Better yet, let someone smother him with a pillow.

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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 12-13-2005, 04:45 AM
 
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Originally posted by spicersh
It doesn't matter who the primary care giver was, nobody should be able to take another person's life. It's not hard to say at all, IMO. This is a very black and white issue to me. I say hang the father. Better yet, let someone smother him with a pillow.


Smother him with a pillow? Then what is that person going to be charged with? Do you believe noone should be able to take another person's life, or is this only when it is convenient for you to say so? Do you even realize that you contradicted yourself with that post?




I say murder 1.
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 12-13-2005, 04:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ZX6R1033
Smother him with a pillow? Then what is that person going to be charged with? Do you believe noone should be able to take another person's life, or is this only when it is convenient for you to say so? Do you even realize that you contradicted yourself with that post?




I say murder 1.
Wow, you jumped on that pretty quick. I really shouldn't have to explain this to you, but why not. Yes, I do believe in the death penalty as punishment. I also don't see a problem with carrying out a death sentence in the manner of the crime that got the person there in the first place.

I didn't go into the details of when I think it is ok to take a life in the original post as I didn't think it was necessary. Apparently it was. Should I go on to say I think it's ok in self defense, or in times of war? Just so as not to confuse you further?

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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 12-13-2005, 05:18 AM
 
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Originally posted by spicersh
Wow, you jumped on that pretty quick. I really shouldn't have to explain this to you, but why not. Yes, I do believe in the death penalty as punishment. I also don't see a problem with carrying out a death sentence in the manner of the crime that got the person there in the first place.

I didn't go into the details of when I think it is ok to take a life in the original post as I didn't think it was necessary. Apparently it was. Should I go on to say I think it's ok in self defense, or in times of war? Just so as not to confuse you further?




I knew what you meant... but I haven't seen anyone giving you a hard time for a while now.
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 12-13-2005, 05:53 AM
 
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Thats a nasty disease http://www.whonamedit.com/synd.cfm/1109.html

I cant condone what he did but i can say the man shouldnt be locked up for life for it. Perhaps some jail time to send a message to other people, but I am sure his service record kept him out of jail.

If it wasnt a kid perhaps it would have been a different story. I know if i get an a bad accident and dont have the use of any limbs and am partially retarded i dont want to be kept alive becasue of our medical knowledge.

Not that this kid was in that way. I'm just asking at what point in time is a Mercy Killing acceptable? If you say never, I pray you never end up with a painful debilatating disease and not have access to modern drugs.

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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 12-13-2005, 06:05 AM
 
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[/B][/QUOTE] Yes, I do believe in the death penalty as punishment. I also don't see a problem with carrying out a death sentence in the manner of the crime that got the person there in the first place.

I didn't go into the details of when I think it is ok to take a life in the original post as I didn't think it was necessary. Apparently it was. Should I go on to say I think it's ok in self defense, or in times of war? Just so as not to confuse you further? [/B][/QUOTE]




I completely agree
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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 12-13-2005, 06:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by drgreenthum
Thats a nasty disease http://www.whonamedit.com/synd.cfm/1109.html

I cant condone what he did but i can say the man shouldnt be locked up for life for it. Perhaps some jail time to send a message to other people, but I am sure his service record kept him out of jail.

If it wasnt a kid perhaps it would have been a different story. I know if i get an a bad accident and dont have the use of any limbs and am partially retarded i dont want to be kept alive becasue of our medical knowledge.

Not that this kid was in that way. I'm just asking at what point in time is a Mercy Killing acceptable? If you say never, I pray you never end up with a painful debilatating disease and not have access to modern drugs.

Best regards
Dr.
The only time a mercy killing is acceptable, IMO, is if the person asks for it. I highly doubt this kid asked his dad for death by asphyxiation. I don't care what his prior service was, he deliberately killed his own kid. He needs to die.

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