D.C. gun ban's effectiveness questioned - Sportbike Forum: Sportbike Motorcycle Forums
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 7 (permalink) Old 03-14-2008, 05:59 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
fasterbusa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Birmingham, MI 48009
Posts: 2,324
D.C. gun ban's effectiveness questioned

The case against DC is getting closer!
These "leaders" in DC are simply delusional.
*****************

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080314/...ington_gun_ban

WASHINGTON - On Sept. 24, 1976, one of the toughest gun laws in the nation took effect in the District of Columbia, essentially outlawing the private ownership of new handguns in a city struggling with violence.

Over the next few weeks, a man with a .32-caliber pistol held up workers at a downtown federal office at midday, a cab driver was shot in the head, and a senator was mugged by three youths, one carrying a revolver, near the U.S. Capitol.

Since the ban was passed, more than 8,400 people have been murdered in the district, many killed by handguns. Nearly 80 percent of the 181 murders in 2007 were committed with guns.

On Tuesday, the Supreme Court is scheduled to hear arguments in a challenge to the city's handgun ban. The case is likely to produce the most important firearms ruling in generations and could undermine other gun control laws nationwide if the court takes an expansive view of the right to bear arms.

The central question is whether the Second Amendment guarantees the right of individuals to bear arms, or instead protects the collective right of states to maintain militias. The court probably won't base its ruling on the effectiveness of Washington's law.

Outside the court, however, a long-debated question is whether a strict gun law like Washington's has any effect on violent crime.

City leaders say the law has kept many guns off the street and warn that violence could increase without it. Firearms still flow in from states like Maryland and Virginia, but District of Columbia officials say the ban reduces the number of legally owned firearms that are stolen or used in domestic killings and suicides.

"Whatever right the Second Amendment guarantees, it does not require the district to stand by while its citizens die," the city wrote in its petition to the Supreme Court last year.

To gun rights advocates, the numbers prove a different point: Violence continues unchecked despite the ban. And while criminals seem to be able to get guns with ease, law-abiding people are being denied the means to protect themselves, they say.

"I should be able to live in the district and protect myself," said Shelly Parker, who said she was harassed and threatened in her former Capitol Hill home by a drug dealer who once tried to break down her door. Parker was a plaintiff in the original case against the city.

Those who live daily with gun violence on Washington's streets, many of them just teens, paint a stark picture of how easy it is to get a firearm. A gun can be bought with a few well-placed calls and a couple hundred dollars.

"Some people look at a gun as part of their outfit," said Maurice Benton, a 19-year-old who says he has never had a gun but was shot in the abdomen by members of a gang while leaving a party in 2006. "They can't go anywhere without it."

The city's gun ban emerged from exasperation. Still reeling from the riots of 1968, the city saw violent crime rise and residents flee to the suburbs. In 1974, two years before the ban took effect, more than half of all homicides were committed with handguns.

There were an estimated 22,000 registered gun owners in the city in 1976, but a Georgetown University poll found three out of four city residents supported the bill. The law cleared the D.C. Council in a 12-1 vote and went on to survive both a court challenge by the National Rifle Association and efforts in Congress to scuttle it.

"Handgun crimes were just getting out of sight," said Sterling Tucker, D.C. Council chairman when the ban was enacted. "We had to isolate and contain the problem. We thought a handgun law would do that."

The law bars private ownership of handguns, with exceptions for law enforcement officers and those who had registered handguns before the ban took effect. Shotguns and rifles are legal, but must be disassembled or stored with trigger locks.

Homicides in the district did ebb over the next few years, largely following a national trend. In 1977, the U.S. Conference of Mayors reported robberies, assaults and homicides using handguns had fallen sharply in D.C. and concluded the ban was working. However, the results were challenged even by the city's police department, which said police tactics had contributed to the drop.

In the late 1980s and early 1990s, murders spiked as Washington, like many other cities, was hit by the crack epidemic. By 1991, the number of homicides reached 479, or 81 deaths per 100,000 people, earning the city status as the nation's murder capital.

Yet that year, a study released by University of Maryland criminologists in the New England Journal of Medicine suggested the gun ban had saved lives in the decade before. They argued the ban had prevented 47 deaths per year in D.C., both suicides and murders. Surrounding areas in Maryland and Virginia had not seen a corresponding drop in gun crime.

The study analyzed data only through 1987, and did not incorporate the higher murder rate during the crack surge, an epidemic critics said revealed the law's weakness. Other criminologists said the study should have compared the district to Baltimore, a city with similar crime problems where violence also declined during the same period. The authors went back and compared the district to other cities, including Baltimore, saying their conclusions still held up.

In the late 1990s, the annual homicide numbers began to fall as the crack scourge ebbed. In the past decade, many of the city's neighborhoods also have undergone a revitalization, attracting more affluent residents. Last year, there were 181 murders.

But the city's location remains a problem for the law. Washington is surrounded by Virginia and Maryland, where guns remain legal, and many firearms can be traced to shops just across the line. The number of guns seized by police has surged in recent years, reaching 2,924 in 2007, nearly 1,000 more than in 2003. Most of the guns were used in crimes.

Sterling Tucker said city officials realized the law had its limits, that guns would never vanish from the streets. And they never imagined it would do away with homicides and violent crime altogether. He believes it has at least provided some check on violence, taken away a tool for some criminals.

"We knew there were problems we couldn't wipe out," he said. "But we had a little more control over it."

Redline Superbike Member
fasterbusa is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 7 (permalink) Old 03-15-2008, 07:41 AM
Registered User
 
Nashcbrguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 39
When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns!!!

I seen this as a bumper sticker back in the 80's and felt that it would be true. Looks like DC is now finding out just how true it is.

Ride it like you stole it, and keep the rubber side down.
Flapper Mod
Stock Exhaust Mod
Front Flush Mounts
Integrated Tail Light
Custom Undertail
Xenon Blue Headlights
Titax Gold Shorts Levers
BTW: Her Name is Nicole

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Nashcbrguy is offline  
post #3 of 7 (permalink) Old 03-15-2008, 08:51 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
fasterbusa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Birmingham, MI 48009
Posts: 2,324
Well sadly, the leaders in the anti gun community still do not feel that way.
As the remarks in the article show, the leaders feel that they actions have probably stopped zillions of attacks by guns over the last 30 years.

They state that even if this ban only stopped one attack, then it was worthwhile banning all guns from law abiding citizens.

Of course, this kind of crazy logic is just plain wrong to all of us gun nuts!

Redline Superbike Member
fasterbusa is offline  
 
post #4 of 7 (permalink) Old 03-16-2008, 08:37 AM
Registered User
 
Jgreen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Wayne, MI
Posts: 1,198
Quote:
Originally Posted by fasterbusa View Post
Well sadly, the leaders in the anti gun community still do not feel that way.
As the remarks in the article show, the leaders feel that they actions have probably stopped zillions of attacks by guns over the last 30 years.

They state that even if this ban only stopped one attack, then it was worthwhile banning all guns from law abiding citizens.

Of course, this kind of crazy logic is just plain wrong to all of us gun nuts!
The logic is not only wrong, its stupid. We could go through the What ifs all day and night.

Home invasions are real! How are you going to protect your family if someone kicks down the door in the middle of the night?

Carjackings are real. Muggings are real! People DO walk into mall, churches, Colleges, and High Schools and start shooting people for no reason. Now, I realize that carrying a gun would not have helped in some of these situations, but absolutely would have helped in others.

My logic is simple. Make it legal to carry a gun. Put you efforts into standardizing who is allowed to carry those guns. If I am planning to commit a crime, in a public place, I might think twice if I know 30% of the people may be carrying a handgun.

In DC the scumbags know that nobody is carrying. Easy pickings.

"Obstacles are what you see when you take your eyes off the goal."

"Hold my beer, watch this"


Redline Superbike Member
Jgreen is offline  
post #5 of 7 (permalink) Old 03-16-2008, 09:33 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
fasterbusa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Birmingham, MI 48009
Posts: 2,324
Well, you understand the problem.
But there are a lot of people who think that if they make guns illegal, no one will have them and we will all be safe.

Another group feels that we should just make the manufacturing of guns illegal and then no one will have them and then we will all be safe.

It is hard to understand how intelligent people can believe that by having nice thoughts, you can keep criminals and bad things at bay.

Now, maybe lots of prayer can help in keeping bad things away, but I have never thought that it would do a thing about the criminal element.

If you pay attention to this Supreme Court case, you will see that there are alot of politically high up people who continue to want to take guns away from the masses. To many gun owners (Sadly, not all gun owners) this is just not acceptable.

And a lot of the high up gun haters do own guns and get to carry guns, but they do not want you to be able to own one or carry one. Very strange.

They understand the problem as they carry, but they think that they are better than normal people and so we cannot have them. That kind of attitude is really a crappy one.

So, we will keep our fingers crossed and hope that the "good guys" (that would be the normal gun populace) win this case!!!

Yea!!!!

Redline Superbike Member
fasterbusa is offline  
post #6 of 7 (permalink) Old 03-17-2008, 04:47 AM
Registered User
 
Sonny_TMCF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Toledo Ohio USA 43614
Posts: 465
Well here is something to chew on...

Since most gun crime is drug related , or atleast most gun crime is on / from someone you know ( victim I mean )

Then perhaps its a thinning of the herd...

Both the victim and the perp cant do crimes no more...


In some twisted way , has gun laws lowered the crime rate ?

(( and YES this is a gross exaggeration of the situation, insert tongue in cheek slightly ))


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Sonny_TMCF is offline  
post #7 of 7 (permalink) Old 03-17-2008, 05:34 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
fasterbusa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Birmingham, MI 48009
Posts: 2,324
So far, the only gun laws that helped in lowering the overall crime rate have been the ones that have expanded the carrying laws for normal citizenry.

All the anti gun-laws that are on the books have not reduced the crime by any amount.

Redline Superbike Member
fasterbusa is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Sportbike Forum: Sportbike Motorcycle Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome