Death of the Pontiac GTO - Sportbike Forum: Sportbike Motorcycle Forums
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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-26-2005, 03:35 PM Thread Starter
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Death of the Pontiac GTO

You guys may be interested to know that the Holden (GM subsid.) Monaro, used as the base for the new Pontiac GTO, is to be discontinued...



Monaro to roar into the sunset

The mighty Monaro, the most charismatic car in Holden showrooms, is doomed.

It is the victim of a tumultuous shake-up of Holden's whole Commodore family to make way for new-age models including all-wheel drives. Holden's production plant in Adelaide is being restructured, building up to the arrival of the all-new VE model midway through next year.

Monaro sales have been slowing, which points to a coming plateau in demand in Australia and also for the export model of the car, the Pontiac GTO, which was developed at Fishermans Bend for sales in the US.

As yet there is no successor to the Monaro in the VE line-up, although Holden is working on several plans, including a heavyweight sports car similar to the Chevrolet Corvette. Holden is painting the decision to end production of the Monaro later this year as a win for the company, even though it will be a big loss for fans.

"This is still the best-selling sports car in the country," spokesman Jason Laird said. "We wanted to go out with a bang while it was still on top. It was a question of us choosing the timing. Champions retire on top."

The Monaro was a 1960s marque, born again in the late 1990s. There was a deafening roar from customers when Holden displayed a Monaro Coupe at the Sydney Motor Show in 1990, and the car was fast-tracked into showrooms.

Only 11,000 have been sold since then in Australia, with overseas sales to Britain and the US taking the total beyond 40,000. The numbers do not make long-term sense when Holden is struggling with back orders on more popular models, including its all-wheel-drive Adventra and V8-powered Commodore SS.

Holden plans to farewell the Monaro with a limited edition car called the CV8-Z due on sale next month. But it may not be the end for Monaro.

"Everyone at Holden is certainly committed to delivering a new-generation Monaro in the future, but there is still a lot of work to make that happen," said Denny Mooney, chairman of GM Holden.





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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-27-2005, 09:25 AM
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There are rumours out there, that GM is developing an '07/'08 Camaro that would spawn a GTO stable-mate. So that could give the Monaro live still. All considering the rumours pan out, that is.

Its sad that GM is letting Ford kick their butt with the Mustang (in the US, that is) and Chrysler is actually talking about a Challenger (based on the 300/Magnum/Charger line) to compete. I don't pretend to understand the situation of their money woes but try compete don't just give up.

Last edited by Penthos; 07-27-2005 at 09:29 AM.
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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-27-2005, 10:58 AM
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Thanks Cookee for some info I haven't seen State-side on this. GTO was a non-attempt at replacing the T/A and Camaro so its loss will be nothing at all to me.

As for Ford kicking GM's tail, even the top current stock Mustangs can't take a the '02 stock T/A and Camaro models on the strips. So I'm not sure what you're referencing, unless its sales. Not something I care about, I guess.

I've heard the Camaro rumors for a while as well. Time will tell, but isn't all that important to me. We've got an '02 T/A and we'll keep it, mod it, and generally enjoy it until it dies. I can't afford to flip cars like many do, but then I always pay cash for everything

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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-27-2005, 02:10 PM
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I was hoping when they killed off the camaro/TA that GM would just stick the 5.7L into one of their concept cars. The 5.7L was a strong motor, and GM makes some cool looking concept cars, but oh well.

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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-28-2005, 06:00 AM
 
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There's a big difference between concept cars and production cars. As for the Monaro, sadly, I don't think that the GTO will be far behind. They are not getting the sales that they had hoped for, and my guess is that the same will happen with the Charger. The Challenger would be an interesting car, but as long as it doesn't look like the 300 or the Charger, it could be a nice car. They need to do like Ford and think back to their heritage. Think of the 440s and also take a look at the Fast & Furious car and Blade's car. That's the heritage, and those old cars are where Ford got their inspiration for the Mustang. Seems to have been a pretty good choice on Ford's part.

Just my .
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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-28-2005, 06:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by wheelie123
They need to do like Ford and think back to their heritage. Think of the 440s and also take a look at the Fast & Furious car and Blade's car. That's the heritage, and those old cars are where Ford got their inspiration for the Mustang. Seems to have been a pretty good choice on Ford's part.

Just my .
I agree to such an extent that I believe GM will ultimately fail if they continue on their conservative design track. For too long their cars have been generally uninteresting. The article comments about the next generation of cars needing production line space, so I'm hoping they will be at least eye-enticing, if not eye-popping.

I love the look of the new 'stangs, though I'd never buy one. Its the right direction. Prowlers are another throwback that I think have beautiful written all over them.

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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 07-28-2005, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by kanwisch
As for Ford kicking GM's tail, even the top current stock Mustangs can't take a the '02 stock T/A and Camaro models on the strips. So I'm not sure what you're referencing, unless its sales. Not something I care about, I guess.
Yeah, I'm talking sales figures. As for performance there isn't a comparison. I owed a '99 Z28 and a '02 Z28 (modified, somewhat), so I am a F-body person.

As for the GTO, it is too heavy and big looking and not budget oriented enough like the F-bodies were.

I'm not too keen on the new Mustang, I think it looks a little bloated. Just my .02!
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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2005, 08:12 PM
 
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i have a few things to say on this issue....

i go to Kettering, previously GMI (general motors institute) and i work in the auto industry for a tier 1 supplier to the big 3 (gm, ford, chrysler if u didnt know) and others. anyways....

i own a 2004 mustang gt, modded, i whup stock camaro z28's and ss's but if they slap on a cold air and a bigger throttle body, maybe a programmer too, im doomed. im not gonna lie.

the reason fords kicking ass with the mustang is #1 it looks enough like the old ones to create a nostalgia fee, but it looks modern and cool enough and its cheap enough for people to buy now.

the gto will die off, its looks suck, its 400hp 6.0L engine in that car beats the 300 hp 4.6L in the 05 mustang by .1 seconds in the 1/4 mile and .1 seconds 0-60. wow, plus the mustangs cheaper (i know cause i priced out a GTO too thought about it till i drove one)

the 07 camaro is pretty cool, but i think its sales will suffer. first of all, it looks WAY too much like a corvette with a flat front end. also, the freakin front looks like SH I T! its headlights are horribly ugly. if their recent concepts are what they are planning on producing, gm could be in a LOT more trouble than they already are. plus, they are gonna slap the 6.0 in it, and it again is gonna cost 30+ grand when someone will at that point be able to get a brand new mustang gt for sub 25g and it will be .1 second slower than it again. if only i had a job at gm, i would walk up to lutz and tell him my ideas......too bad i didnt even apply there cause if they dont change a LOT freakin hyundai is gonna surpass them in sales for christs sake

its too bad the monaro is dying....but to tell you the truth, austrailia has more sports cars than here from OEM's. ok we get the ford taurus, and you get that decked out [email protected]$$ supercharged 4 door car from ford, i forgot what its called, but its not even offered here and ive seen reviews on it and people down under seem to love it....its kinda like how europe often gets some cooler bikes than here (in my opinion)

but on that subject, i was VERY into cars as a kid too, and when i saw the first concept for the gto (i was maybe 16 or 17, not that long ago) i said "holy crap, thats a holden!" and i actually knew what holden was, and my dad was like what? but anyways, i thought it was gonna be really freakin cool at first, till i drove it. i was like....wow, im gonna go buy a 2004 mustang (which i love the looks of over the new ones) and i ended up stealing it from the dealer (not literally) after my work discount and all the cash back promos, so i was like.....sweeeeeeeeeeet.

anyways, point to my story is ford created so much hype about the mustang, and they followed through. thats why sales for mustangs are up 47% from last year, and used sales on mustangs are up like 20 some %. yes, used 04 and older ones are up in sales. everyone wants a mustang. now if gm can create that much hype about the camaro in 07, and really FOLLOW through with it, they should have a solid money maker.

oh yeah, and the 300 and 300C are awesome cars, and how can you say (whoever said it) that sales suck on them, cause sales are actually awesome on them and they got that new srt8 comin out that will hang with stangs and gtos off the shelf....in a big 4 door. its got the 6.0 hemi i think. yeah anyways, i wouldnt knock that car. plus, the sales on the magnum are kickin, and i bet the charger is gonna get some good sales outta it too, its a 4 door sports car that still looks cool, cant beat chryslers functionality and cool points combined together, they are the masters at that.

BTW i heard rumors of chrysler droppin the mitsubishi line....that means no more eclipse very very disappointing to me.....if it actually happens.
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-18-2005, 10:12 PM
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I say good riddance to that thing they try to call a GTO. It is a disgrace to the lineage, and has no business being called a GTO. It has no character whatsoever as a muscle car in the same ilk of the original.

The Chrysler 300c is a nice looking car on the outside but the interior has the personality of a 2x4. I had a '70 Cadillac Eldorado that had a straight dashboard like the 300, but it looked a lot better than the Chrylser 300. But we are in 2005, 35 years AFTER my Eldorado was designed!!!!! My point is that the interior has absolutely no organic feel at all, it is outdated, it is used in at least one other Chrysler product, and it has all the feel of a big square car of the 60's or 70's. Also, the seats are not very comfortable for long hauls.

The problem with some of Chrysler's designs is that they are novelty designs that wear off after a few seasons. Such as the PT Cruiser. It sold well for about two years, now their lots are full of them. That will happen with the 300 because it is an orphan vehicle. It is marketed to those wanting a BMW or Mercedes big four door, but who don't have the money for one of them. So when it comes time to sell the used 300, it will have a low resale value, and many who own one will eventually have more money to spend and will test drive a Mercedes or BMW and find out what they are missing.

The SRT 8 is a wanna be that will never be. It does not have a manual transmission and so it is going nowhere fast. No one who wants performance wants a big tub like that, with a motor like that, with an automatic. But if you are big and fat and have arthritis, an automatic seems to make more sense I guess.

With the price of gas going ever upward, the people who can afford to put gas in a high performance luxury performance car are those who buy M5's not Chrysler 300's.

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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 08-19-2005, 12:44 AM
 
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burn....i work on the seats in that car

i really enjoy the interior, i think its simple yet sleek and modern, and the analog clock really sets it off, i remember the 80's grand prix's with the anolog clock and i was like....cooooool

i personally have done pressure mapping tests, extened sits, and a helluva lot of testing on those seats, and i think they are pretty damn nice myself. but i havent done like a long day in them, so i cant comment too much on it

anyways, you do realize that the 300 is not a new car right? its been around for a while, its just got a new look

its doing very well because its a good looking, big, great bang for buck car. you get a v8, leather, fully loaded, 4 door, chrome rims, ANALOG CLOCK!! for under 35g? that sounds to me like direct competition. now i will agree somewhat with you on the srt....some of those are just wayyyy to expensive for what they are. i was at a dealership about 2 months ago, and the new srt6 (supercharged crossfire) was 47g! i was like wtf why would i buy that garbage instead of a c6, or hell id rather have 2 mustangs for that price! srt is a little too much bells and whistles for a lot of money.

but fuster, good argument made....whats your view on the charger and the magnum? i really like the chargers, i hope they last, they are a very good lookin car. especially that burnt orange color with black accents....nice. although a competition orange would be better (i like comp orange, thats half the reason i got my stang)
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