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post #1 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2001, 02:31 AM Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 23
opinions wanted

what are your views on the following accident see attached image
Bike is on the main road that has traffic going between 50 to 70 mph with about 200 cars per half hour.
Bike is making a left turn into the side road with a speed limit of 25 mph and traffic load of about 8 cars per half hour.
Out of the side road comes a car. He has a stop sign but no white line by the stop sign and flies past at estimated speed of about 40 mph. The bike sees the car slams the brakes and stops with its rear wheel up in the air
the car sees the bike slams the brakes but too late ..makes contact with the bike estimated speed of car when it hit the bike 8 mph. the bike goes down. all happens when the bike has already entered the side road ...see image.

decisions of insurance companies:
bikes insurance says bike was 0 to 30 % at fault ...they refuse to pay for damages to the car (about $1000)
car's insurance : the car was at no more then 50 % at fault therefore they refuse to pay for damages to the bike. car insurance arguments:
1 they claim bike made improper turn
2. they have a witness that testified that car did nothing wrong
What are your opinions/suggestions
I am the bike driver and bike's damage is $2100
Attached Images
File Type: gif colision3.gif (5.7 KB, 213 views)

Last edited by RedNinja; 10-14-2001 at 03:21 AM.
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post #2 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2001, 03:22 AM
 
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I resized yer pic so it wasn't all over the screen.

Opinion: IF the car failed to stop at the stop sign, then the bike is not at fault. It would be 100% to the driver of the cage (which it usually is )
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post #3 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2001, 03:53 AM
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
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Sorry to say but in Ohio this would be about a 50% to 50% crash. When making a left turn the person making the left turn is required to maintain his correct side of the road. By what you show you are left of center on a messed up intersection. The car would be allowed to stop at the stop sign in Ohio but if they wish to get a better view of the intersection they would be allowed to go up but not enter the crossroad. But if the car did this in a reckless manner it could be a failure to yield or reckless operation on the car. The last case in this area that was close to this the judge found that no laws put either person clearly at fault and did not find either person guilty. So what will it will come down to is a law suit or both of the parties will cover thier own damage thus I see it as about 50% to 50%.
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post #4 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2001, 08:54 AM
 
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In CA. it would probably be 50/50 since the bike made a left across traffic. Once my wife sat on a jury where a guy in a car turned left and a bike hit him and was killed. The cyclist was going 80 in a 35, drunk by a least two times the limit, no helmet, no shoes, no shirt, with an old bike with a barely functioning rear brake ONLY, not registered, no mc license/insurance and the way the law read the car was at fault and he was found guilty of some type of vehicular manslaughter. Watch that left turn...
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post #5 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2001, 10:50 AM
 
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What did the police report say? I clearly don't see you at fault. When it goes to court, the supposed witness has to take off work and come in and they rarely do. If you don't pursue a lawsuit, don't just let it go. You have the peoples address that hit you on the police report, that would be a serious bumber if I were in your shoes. Don't let anyone get the best of you, or, let them think they got the best of you.
Shannon
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post #6 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2001, 12:49 PM Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by RobG
In CA. it would probably be 50/50 since the bike made a left across traffic. Once my wife sat on a jury where a guy in a car turned left and a bike hit him and was killed. The cyclist was going 80 in a 35, drunk by a least two times the limit, no helmet, no shoes, no shirt, with an old bike with a barely functioning rear brake ONLY, not registered, no mc license/insurance and the way the law read the car was at fault and he was found guilty of some type of vehicular manslaughter. Watch that left turn...
You are quoting left turn as if that was a rule or something. Well let me remind you that the rule is YIELD TO THE VEHICLE THAT IS ON YOUR RIGHT and it overides the left turn rule. so look where I was on the drawing. I asked for opinions-- true-- but I was really looking for ones from people who know what they are talking about.
and I WAS NOT DOING 80 ON 35 I WAS NOT DRUNK...AND MY BRAKES WERE WORKING ...SO WHAT DOES YOUR STORY HAVE TO DO WITH MINE AND WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT????????????????????????????????????????????? ??????

Last edited by kreksik; 10-14-2001 at 12:52 PM.
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post #7 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2001, 01:41 PM
 
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Relax. I was not insinuating anything only trying to show that even when, in this case, the bike had a whole lot more to do with the wreck, that the driver was at fault based on him entering the lane of on-coming traffic, ie; the left turn. Like I said in the beginning of my post, it would probably be 50/50 here in CA.
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post #8 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2001, 01:55 PM
 
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Update...

After checking with a friend in the Calif. Highway Patrol, again, here in CA. you would be more at fault based on you making a turn into the on-coming traffics blind area by cutting the corner, if your diagram is accurate. In the diagram you show that had you gone forward to where the double lines break, there would have been a clear view of on-coming traffic and therefore you would have likely been able to avoid the vehicle that blew the sign, but since you did cut the corner, the sign blower was unable to have a clear view up to the cross street to avoid hitting you. Bummer, though.
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post #9 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2001, 02:13 PM
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
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While not everything that RobG states fits your crash some of it dose. By Ohio laws when making a left turn you do have to stay on the correct side of the road. Your drawing clearly puts you crossing the portion of the road that the car is allowed to be on instead of making a wide turn and staying on the righthand side of the road you, so to say cut the corner. If your looking for everyone to say you were 100% correct I don't think you will find it here just since we ride. Just for your info I'am a professional crash investigator with over ten years in law enforcement. To give a better percent of who was more incorrect than the other I would want to hear the other side of the story.

PS. If you have not figured it out by now if you are on two wheels you need to ride as if everybody is out to hit you and not make it easy for them by taking a short cut. I still say improper intersection design dose play a part in this but, about all that might happen from this is a no left turn sign being placed at the intersection for you.

The roads are not a race track and for the most part have lines on them we need to follow and be in the correct place to be 100% correct.

You did seem to have a good race line though. Maybe a little late on the apex.

Last edited by suzmcman; 10-14-2001 at 02:32 PM.
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post #10 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2001, 02:20 PM
 
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RobG I think you need to read what I had in my first post. I was giving kerksik the benifit of all doubt by saying the car was at some fault. He must have been told what his new insurance bill was and needed to take it out on somebody and didn't read between the lines.
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